hour rule - i got 99 problems....

"505 - morphine not found" (morphine500) 01/02/2014 at 07:47 • Filed to: Peugeot

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...but an LSD ain't one. This is a first for me: as of two weeks ago, the otherwise punily underpowered, but still rwd 505 got a factory limited slip diff installed, and it works quite well. In the dry, and on the wet at least.

However, there is no snow around here. There should be, but there's none. I am a sad panda. Here's the nothing video we shot last year with the ratty Pug, let's hope to better this considerably before spring 2014 arrives upon us.

CalzoneGolem > 505 - morphine not found 01/02/2014 at 07:58

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Come up north we got plenty of snow.

BiTurbo228 - Dr Frankenstein of Spitfires > 505 - morphine not found 01/02/2014 at 14:51

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Sweet :) is it a torsen or a clutch-type?

505 - morphine not found > BiTurbo228 - Dr Frankenstein of Spitfires 01/02/2014 at 16:42

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I really cannot tell, but its a very rudimentary design - dates back to the time Audi came up with the very first torsen designs, so its maybe not that. There are springs in there, that give a pre-tension to the diff, but that is all, nothing fancy, just limiting slip, all the time. The brakes are also done the gearbox sorted, new shocks all around, so the car finally starts to resemble, well, a car. Works very well on dirt roads, as an old peugeot, deskgned for african roads, should.

BiTurbo228 - Dr Frankenstein of Spitfires > 505 - morphine not found 01/02/2014 at 16:56

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Boss, glad to hear of the progress. If it's got springs it's probably a clutch-type. As far as I know torsens only contain gears.

Was the plan to swap a turbo engine in there, or am I imagining that?

505 - morphine not found > BiTurbo228 - Dr Frankenstein of Spitfires 01/02/2014 at 18:02

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Engine swap is a plan, but it'll remain na. I've got a 2.2 ohc injection engine in my moms' garage, waiting to replace the 2.0 ohv carb in the car right now. However it'll need a complete overhaul, and in truth maybe a bit of tune, so the costs won't allow this to happen just yet. No matter, the ohv runs well, the only thing i need to do to it is a carb overhaul - the poor solex needs gakets...

BiTurbo228 - Dr Frankenstein of Spitfires > 505 - morphine not found 01/02/2014 at 19:28

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There's no rush, but if it's the old Simca 2.2l then they're rather good engines. Used in a couple of hot cars at least, so they should be fairly tunable.

What sort of power would you be looking at?

505 - morphine not found > BiTurbo228 - Dr Frankenstein of Spitfires 01/03/2014 at 04:35

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It's not the simca one - that block only saw work in the 505 with a turbo bolted on. 505 petrol engines go like this:

1.8 - ohv carb Pug engine from the 504. Fun fact: it's slant sideways to make room for the downdraft carb, and because of that, needs a specially formed oil pan.

2.0 - very same as above, but with bigger bore. I have this in my car.

2.0 TI - the "Douvrin" engine, a full alloy, OHC, L-Jetronik engine, brand new when the 505 was launched in 1979. It was manufactured in the Douvrin plant, that was a joint-venture with Renault, so this engine saw work in a lot of Renaults too - the latest versions of it were the 3-valve engines in the Safrane and Espace. Renault has turbocharged this engine but not Peugeot.

2.2 TI - the very same as above but with a longer stroke - head is the same with both versions. The 505 changed to only feature the 2.2 from 1982, but other cars still had 2.0 versions going. I have an example of this in the garage, complete with the L-Jetronik.

2.2 Turbo - This is the famous Simca engine. Iron block with alloy head, and the output ranged between 150-180 HP in the 505 depending on MY and version. Also, there was a widely accepted tuning kit taking it above 200 HP, way above in some cases . Lots of cars had this engine in NA form too, the Matra Murena for instance, but not the 505.

V6 - the ubiquitous "PRV" V6. This was also manufactured in Douvrin, so in some publications it's called the "Douvrin" V6. This engine only got in the 505 late, as Peugeot didn't want to hurt 604 sales, so 505 had to wait until the bigger brother went out of production. The front suspension is a bit different, than in other models.

I allways wanted my 505 with the 2.2 TI engine - though very few were sold as TI, most were STI or GTI, (S and G being designates of trim) so i was looking for those. Factory power ranged between 110-130 HP, also, before the Turbo bowed in, there was a factory-approved tuning kit by Danielson that had 136 HP. This is extremely rare nowadays, but easily recognisable, as it had special Pirelli alloys and a sports steering wheel as well as special shocks and the tuned engine. Lookit:

Ideally i would have the 2.2 TI completely overhauled, and then install either a brand new programable injection and ignition set, in place of the 30 YO Bosch, or two Weber DCOE carbs. The former would be much easier, as we could use the factory induction and just change the injectors and the computers, cabling etc. The latter is of course much more fitting to the age of the car, but would need a uniqe induction drawn up and manufactured, because no tuning kit is avalialbe to do this. (there is a bolt-on weber kit for the 1.9 sports engine in the 205 GTI, 309 GTI and 405 MI 16, but that motor won't fit the 505).

I would wager that both ways would cost roughly the same, and the goal with either would be around 150 HP. As the car weighs the same as a modern Miata does, it should be plenty fun with that much. However, I don't see either happening in 2014 - there is only minor work left on the 505 otherwise, so my big goal for this year would be to get together enough greeines to do the bodywork needed on the MR-2.

You didn't ecpect this avalanche of info, did you :-)

BiTurbo228 - Dr Frankenstein of Spitfires > 505 - morphine not found 01/03/2014 at 13:20

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Info's always good, especially if there's lots of it :)

So, we could conceivably make a 2.0l Turbo 505 with the 12v alloy Douvrin 2.0l and some turbo bits from Renaults. It'd be a lot of work, but considering they never made a RHD turbo 505 as the exhaust manifold fouled on the steering column.

Personally, I'd go the injection route to get 150bhp. It'll be more tractable, more economic and easier to start. Webers sound fantastic, and can make pretty much the same power as injection, but there are compromises that injected engines just don't experience.

Hell, you could get a set of ITBs and head for 180bhp :)

505 - morphine not found > BiTurbo228 - Dr Frankenstein of Spitfires 01/03/2014 at 13:25

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ITBs......